Let me give you an example: last week someone asked me if they could file bankruptcy – specifically chapter 13. They were two months behind on the mortgage. Two months behind on car payments. And only $1500 in credit card debt. They also shared various facts about their lifestyle that in my opinion, required change. I told them no, and I gave them my opinion why. Will they go out and find someone who will tell them what they want to hear? Maybe. But it will not be me. If they are foolish to file bankruptcy, they will pay a heavy price.

At the risk of appearing snippy, I do not need to google “Bankruptcy & Stress.” I have been practicing bankruptcy law for over 10 years, and been doing it almost exclusively for 4. I write about it (here and elsewhere), study it, give seminars on it, and generally consider it one of the big reasons that gets me out of bed in the morning.

We’re all “experts on our opinions.” But any sound opinion is based on facts, and when a client comes to me, they get an opinion based on the facts of their individual situation.

And to address a really important point you make: “…do a budget, live on LESS than you make, have an emergency fund, etc.” I could not agree more. But our world is not so simple, and the financial issues facing people now – and that will face people in the future will only grow more complicated. I would love to discuss why this is, but there is no simple answer. That discussion is for another day – and perhaps another blog.

Thanks for keeping this dialogue going…I hope this discussion helps people make the right decision that they feel best for them.

–Bill

PS, as for approving comments, so long as the discussion is related to the topic, and it’s not patently offensive, it will get approved. If I were concerned about people disagreeing with me, I’d really have to consider changing professions. Please know that in almost all cases, links in comments will be deleted.

You really should listen to the show for a couple of weeks to get the full impact. The gist is that this stuff is mainly about behavior. People call in all the time that have already filed bankruptcy, didn’t change their habits, and are right back in the same boat.

You can’t pickout part of what Dave says without looking at the totality of it … do a budget, live on LESS than you make, have an emergency fund, etc.

As far as the “psyche” issue, just google Bankruptcy and Stress and you might get an education. Your statement that “People get over it and they move on with their lives once they have their appendix removed. People also get over it and they move on with their lives once their debt is cleared up or reorganized in a more manageable way. They also tend to sleep better.” is probably true for a lot of people. They can go right back into the habits that got them there in the first place.

“Of course, I would expect to be asked for that opinion – I would not just approach some random couple on the street who were fighting and offer my unsolicited opinion.” – I am not sure what all of this is about. There is a reason it’s called THE DAVE RAMSEY SHOW. Dave is an expert on his opinions.

He does try to unpack the details, but often tells folks they need more advice than a 3 minute radio call and should seek further advice. However, on the vast majority of calls related to people thinking of bankruptcy, it doesn’t take 3 minutes to see that the caller is nowhere near bankrupt and most of the time has a lot of other options. In Dave’s words on these cases, filing bankruptcy is like dropping an atom bomb on an ant.

I do commend you for approving comments that may disagree with you. I see from your other posts that you have Dave are in agreement on the bailout and government debt. You should try listening to his show. There is a lot more to it than bankruptcy. You can listen to all of the archives free daily at or every night on the Fox Business Channel.

You stated that “Most cases can be solved with selling a car or two and getting intense and focused on living on nothing, working extra jobs, and paying down debt.” By the time many of my clients have come to me, they have already liquidated their retirement, tapped out the home equity, and been spending a considerable amount of time robbing Peter to pay Paul. They are also coming to me because they did not prepare well enough for those things they cannot control: like a job loss or family illness.

If Dave is helping them “cure the disease” as you put it, he is probably helping far more people when they are first realizing that there is a problem…which I am willing to bet is long before they think of coming to me. And that’s a good thing.

I cannot and will not speak for other bankruptcy lawyers (at least not on this topic). I can only speak for myself. I stand by my prior statements.

Actually, it’s not my intent to “undermine” his work. It’s rather to inform and to help people make informed and educated choices about what’s best for them (which is what any good lawyer would do). It is my hope that people will get all of the information they need and then make the best decision that is best for their individual circumstances – and do it earlier, rather than later, when they have more options. You must at least acknowledge that but for the very limited advice he can give to callers on his radio and television shows, Dave Ramsey cannot provide that level of individualized counsel and advice. And that’s what I stress in my blog.

And on whether my clients have come in and said to me “Well, Dave said…”, you are partially right. I have had clients rave about the post-filing/pre-discharge debtor education course he offers (and is linked on this website). I have never had clients come to me before filing telling me what they heard Dave Ramsey say.

Dave has a “one size fits all” message on his website. The point of my blog is to remind people that “one size” rarely, if ever, fits all and to find out what is best for their individual needs, goals and problems.

I hate to get off topic: but if a friend or relative came to you and told you their spouse or partner was abusing them, what would you tell them? Stay together and work it out for the kids? Get real.

Thanks for your comments,

–Bill

You raise a good point: among other things, it takes a change in lifestyle and means by which to create income to build financial stability for people and their families. However, there are other issues as well: illness, job, age, etc., all of which are unique to a persons situation. Sometimes, people face bankruptcy because they made bad decisions. Others face bankruptcy because bad decisions were made that affected them.

And as for telling people not to file: without belaboring the point, it happens more than you think.

–Bill

Now, you have to be truthful here. You may be an exception but the typical bankruptcy lawyer is not going to turn their clients away who are looking for a way out. A bankruptcy lawyer is not going to sit down with their clients and look for other ways to get out of their financial mess. That’s like a Ford car salesman telling his customer, “This Ford Taurus is not for you. You should look into a Chevrolet Malibu.” Come on, get real!

And I believe this blog is written with the purpose to undermine Dave’s work. I bet you had a few clients come talk to you and they said “Well, Dave said…” Then you started thinking who is this Dave guy. I’m gonna check him out. After reading a few excerpts from the website, you don’t like what you read cause it takes away from your business.

One other thing, divorce… really you would recommend a divorce? Come on man. That’s one of the reason’s our culture is so screwed up and kids have difficulty searching for a positive role model or feeling loved which leads to much worse.

You said you tell people not to file for bankruptcy if they need it, but I bet that is rare. You ARE a bankruptcy attorney after all, so I’ll have to take your comment with a huge grain of salt.

And yes, I’m a DR fan. He’s been doing this for 20 years, with millions of listeners and viewers. I’d hardly call him a “pop-financial-guru”.

I didn’t search for sound bites. I merely read his website and if you clicked the links, you’d see that they were taken from his website (and there’s a link to one of his sites on my Resources page). If you are able, please post a link with “Mr. Ramsey’s favorite saying on this topic…”. I do not want readers making any unfounded assumptions about this statement without a link.

As I stated:

“I also have the decency to talk someone out of bankruptcy if I thought it was an unwise decision.”

On that note, and to address the comment you attribute to Mr. Ramsey: I’m no dog, nor am I ever that hungry. There may very well be attorneys that you or Mr. Ramsey may be acquainted with that fit that description. I am not one of them.

With that said, I sincerely hope that Mr. Ramsey did not utter such a statement. I do not want people struggling with debt to erroneously assume that bankruptcy attorneys offer them nothing more than door-to-door vacuum cleaner salesmen.

Thanks for chiming in.

–Bill

Somehow, you missed Dave’s favorite saying on this topic … “asking a bankruptcy lawyer if you should file bankruptcy, is like asking a dog if it’s hungry.”